10
Monday, May 5, 1980
University Daily Kansan
Dykes...
From page one
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Q: One of the problems facing all universities in the United States is declining enrollment. Do you believe a decline at KU?
A: Well, the Board of Regents official courses have been released and of course these courses are difficult to know what the enrollment will be in the future. When I came to school, soon to be seven years old, the most prevalent from interviews by people like yourselfs and in talking with faculty and staff was what can we do about our declining numbers.
That was seven years ago, the enrollment was 18,000. Today, and year since then, we have had record numbers — over 20,000 and I would be very hesitant to say that within the next four years we'll have an enrollment decline or within the next five years we'll have an enrollment increase.
Because there are so many variables in projecting student enrollments, that is absolutely impossible to measure. University is that enrollment will be stable for a period of time, but that it will trend downward because the faculty cries in the number of huth school seniors.
University of Kansas enrollment could decline 25 to 30 percent without any serious dislocation on the part of the faculty because of the great number of non-temure students. We don't really think, although there's a great deal of talk about it in the news media and elsewhere, that that is a very significant problem for the University of Kansas. Moreover, there are a lot of professional teachers there who have a huge backlog of people trying to get into it.
Q: Is there going to be an enrollment level where we'll have to say we can't accept any more students?
A: Well, I think what is happening in the University right now is that student's choices about fields of study are changing very dramatically. Students are attempting to acquire a set of skills as opposed to academic units in the College of Liberal Arts and Sciences, and that's making a significant difference in the enrollment preference. I don't think that we see the time where we'll say to people in the university can't accept them at all in the university.
We have lots of students now who apply for certain programs and can't be accepted in those programs because they're
overloaded. But they come on to the University anyhow and enroll somewhere else. Some of them make other decisions once they're in the University.
But it isn't unusual at all, as a matter of fact, it's a common daily occurrence for students to be told they can't enroll in this program or that program because it's full
Q: You have said that as other universities in the state decline in their enrollments the University of Kansas could possibly have an increase.
A: That's very true. There is a shift occurring and one of the reasons why enrollments are in some of the largest institutions in this area new students are choosing to come here.
An additional factor in enrollment is that we're located here at the corridor between Topena and Kansas City, which is a fairly significant growth area in the state. We were looking at population figures just the other day, as we did with Johnson alone, there is substantially more than a half-million people.
And then if you add Leavenworth, and then you add Omaha, you got almost a million people, or almost 40% of the state's population here in a little area with the University of Kansas square in the city.
And that will have an impact, especially as the cost of fuel increases and as the cost of going to school gets more expensive. It is terribly difficult to project enrolments. And the single most important characteristic of the enrolments projections that have been made is the Lawrence campus of the University of Kansas has been that they all have been wrong.
Q: What are your feelings about diventement of KU interests in South Africa?
A: Well it's a very complicated issue. It's not amenable to simple answers either way. The Endowment doesn't have the ability to realize the income. A great number of the companies in which investments are made obviously do business in the public sector as potential sources of investment would mean that we would rule out such companies or other sources of other fundinging companies in this country.
there is also a profound disagreement about the role of the American companies in South Africa, and depending on whom you talk with you get different answers. I'm not prepared to say that all Americans do believe that generally the impact of the American influence in South Africa has been positive. Were it not for the presence of American companies the
conditions in South Africa would probably be much worse and I believe the presence of American companies in South Africa is a liberalizing influence in South African society.
moreover if the American companies should leave their place would simply be taken by other countries or even the world. So you don't really put any pressure on the South African government by pulling out, in my opinion. Most of the major universities in the country like our own Endowment Association, to not divest. In many cases there have been court rulings that they cannotdivest because of the cost of investment and invest funds to secure a reasonable return.
4: What message then do you have for the students who are deeply concerned about South Africa?
A: I would ask them to get well informed about the issue. Either you for it or against it. And like most issues there are enormous complications.
Q: Another issue which I know you must be tired of hearing about is the whole Norman Forer issue.
Q: When do you plan on making a public statement on the issue?
A: Yes.
A: We don't plan on making any statements beyond what have been made.
B: Eyes?
Q: Ever.
A: Easier as far as I'm concerned.
A. Ever as the matter has been settled?
Q: Do you feel the matter has been setled?
A: As far as the University is concerned, the matter is settled. I think there is an enormous misunderstanding about that issue too.
4. Most of the complaints are that people have not enough information and they aren't satisfied. They don't know who's right and who's wrong.
A: We probably would never have the information because in it we don't want to judge there who is right and who is wrong. From the University's standpoint our view is a very difficult one.
The person left his job. His pay was terminated. I don't think there's any other position that would give him the other position would ultimately lead to chase in the institution. Anybody would have to take this seriously, I would believe very firmly and he probably correct that his reasons were good. But he is employed by the University to perform research. He should be the duties have to be met or the contractual
I don't believe the University could exist as an institution unless there is that kind of understanding. There are great numbers of people at the University who have very firm beliefs about the meaning and other matters that face our nation and face the world, just as there are many students.
relationship between that person and the University is terminated.
I would suspect that if you had a great conviction that you ought to be in Iran at hand, you would probably be faced with Iran that you would probably be faced with failing grades at the end of the semester. But the question of freedom of speech is the central freedom — I think all these are irrelevant.
Q: Were there more complaints about the Forer issue than other issues this year?
A: Not necessarily. In the controversies that one has in the universities you could have a losing basketball season and get a huge boost about that than a professor's trip to Iran.
Q: Were Forer's rights of due process as accorded in the faculty and staff handbook observed?
A: Yes, he was offered the opportunity to pursue the matter through the procedures outlined in the faculty handbook and he chose not to do so. Now I did not want to go to college because I have never met with Professor Forer or other officials at the university did.
Q: Professor Forer has said that he would like an "open confrontation" with you about the issue. Would you consent to this?
A: No. I would not consent to this and I do not think it would be useful because the University cannot be put into the position where decisions that are made, all the decisions that are made, many of which are unpopular. There are procedures at the University for settling differences between professors. If a person chooses not to use the procedures then that's a choice they will obviously have to make. But in the case of Professor Forre we had a choice on the level of levels of the University administration.
Obviously I'm the person who ultimately has to decide those issues. If I acted on the recommendations of the administration. What the University did was a recommendation ranging all through those steps. And that's generally the whole decision process. I don't know that it would be necessary for the chancellor of the University to engage every student or every professor in the course of action. Because if we engaged in that procedure in settling our
differences I doubt very much if our difference will ever be settled.
In addition, the whole elaborate process, which we have developed in the University over the years for settling differences, would go unused. That’s precisely what it is.
We often have people who choose not to use those, for whatever reason. Sometimes they want to be outside the University to use the judicial system and we've had people do this quite regularly.
The Faculty Senate Executive Committee recently approved one of its committee outlines for video tapping of events on campus. What are your feelings about this report?
A: We essentially accepted the commissions of the department. Our recommendations were very compatible with the principles that had been enumerated later. Dr. Dei (Dr.) Shankel executive officer charged with these.
The only area where there was any difference of opinion was in the committee that we should videotape it, whether video tapeing should go on. We simply said there that it would not be together, but where it is possible we would ask the committee to meet before a decision is made. The only condition I think we have for this to happen in the committee would be summoned and used where possible. But we have no absolute assurance that we would always use a
Q: Does that mean you support the principles in the report?
principles in the report.
A: Yes. And they are very much like the one Dr. Shankel set out last fall.
Q: What about your own committee report on the statute of freedom of speech?
A. Well I think the report is a good report and I don't have any great disagreements with any part of it. The only reason that we haven't taken any action on it is that the three vice chancellors have been away and we haven't had a chance to discuss it.
Q: What in your opinion is the status of freedom of speech at KU?
A: I think there is an unfettered freedom of speech at the University. I think the University has obviously always conflict about the exercise of different freedoms but I am confident that the University of Kansas has not. I think it is continue to do so in the future.
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I think the report will be a step in that direction. I think the university goes, has historically had a leadership position in protecting freedom of speech and will continue do so in the future.
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A: No, really I don't, because most of the issues that arise in the University are issues of some considerable concern. I can't remember even though the basic decision has been made at a very different level of the University. I don't think that simple it is. If the decision point in the University that compromises any of the procedures of the University, because there was an issue of the decision point then the question would still be raised about the conflict of interest at that level. There has to be a point somewhere where the decisions are finally
Q: While we're on the subject, the University Judiciary comes to mind. The charges that Professor Leban brought against you - had they been made all the hearings and had the University Judiciary decided to rule on sanctions according to his charges against you or your office, do you think the integrity or autonomy of the judiciary would be affected by such a decision that you have had the final say on any sanctions against yourself?
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Q: Returning to budgetary matters, what are your feelings on the athletic department deficit?
A: Well the athletic department has to live within its budget, and they will. It’s always difficult to project what their revenue will be if the athlete can influence Saturday can influence your budget significantly if the people don’t show up. The Athletic department, like all other units in the city, will have a budget and they will live within its budget. That may mean a reduction in programs and other activities. I hope those reductions will not crucial to the participation of athletes.
Q: In a particular case such as this one where a charge is directed against you and your office do you see a conflict in that?
A: The University is not an autonomous enclave free from the larger society. It's part of it. And consequently my decision in any matter that comes before the judiciary while I am the final authority of the University. I'm clear there is an entire array of other appeals outside the University.
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sut as far as the internal processes are concerned, then obviously there has to be an final authority. For good or for bad, that happens to be the chief administrative officer of the University, and it is not the final appeal within the University compromises the procedures, because a person who doesn't like the ultimate answer can always avail himself or
Q: How do you feel about the gymnastics program being terminated?
Next year will be the tough year because we have not only one football game. We will play all three games, plus a major league of a drawing like we played Michigan last year and the year before we played Tensi
A: Well I think it's always too bad when you have to eliminate sports. But again, if you don't have the resources to carry them on, then hard work is required. We would like to have a well rounded comprehensive sports program that would provide maximum opportunity for student athletes within the University to play football or basketball historically had a greater number of programs than most other schools in our athletic conference and I expect that we will continue to have even more, even though they are not as rich as some of the other schools.
Q: Could you require the athletic department to balance its budget?
A: Yes.
A: Well, I don't know when it was in the media. You have to remember that what was repeated in the media to be a deficit isn't just that it's not important in the University at any point in time and find that they're running a deficit but the bottom line is where they end up the next day. So if you spend a disproportionate amount of their budget in the fail, they spend a disproportionate amount of their budget in the fail. So to look at it at the night, you you've got a large margin in the fail in the black by a small margin.
A: Absolutely
Q: Was the budget delicit brought to your attention before it was reported in the media?
Q: You will have been the chancellor of "University of Kansas for seven years." A: The tenure at KU has been fairly long for University chancellors, much longer than the national average. The national average in major universities for presidents is 54%. Four and eight years. And the average here at KU is, I'm certain, double that. It's difficult to answer a question like how long will you stay. I really don't know. I plan to be here every year. For a university administration goes to very difficult to project ahead.
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