UNIVERSITY DAILY KANSAN Thursday, April 15, 1993 5 Many students take longer to graduate Story continued from. Page 1. kinds of comments all the time from students. The student comments concern him, he says, but he takes them with a grain of salt. "No one really likes advising, Van Zandzai said. "It is subject to more criticism than anything at the University. Some of it we agree with, and some of it we don't." When a student must take an extra semester to graduate because of misinformation from an academic failure, the student, VanZandt said. "That doesn't happen frequently, but it does happen," he admitted. But, VarZandi said, students could receive unwanted academic advice from their parents. And that can cost the student an extra year or two in some cases. Some parent attitudes just do not mesh with what the student wants to do. He said many parents were very supportive, but when students' desires conflict with parents' demands, students usually continue with the major until they can't take it anymore. And so they have to start over their junior year. "By that time, it will take at least an extra year to graduate," VanZandt said. Jim Carothers, dean of the College of Liberal Arts and Sciences, said he believed that advising within the schools was generally good, particularly when students reach their junior or senior year. "If students seek advisement they should be OK." Carothers said. should be OK," Carothers said. Instead of beefing up advising, Cairns is more concerned about making suit, fresher get off to a good start "We talk all the time about improving the quality of the freshman experience" he said. "If they have a good first semester, it radically enhances their chances of finishing on time." Carothers said some modest gains, such as the improvement of some basic courses like Math 101, had improved students' chances of succeeding early. The number of students who passed that class doubled when the course was improved in 1901 --- If course, all the advising in the world cannot help if there are no classes for the students to take. Students have been complaining aboved closed classes for a long time, and many of the students participating in the summer orientation survey also complained there were no classes available once they figured out their schedules. "There is nothing more frustrating for me and for the student than when we have a good schedule figured out and they can't get any of the classes on it," social welfare's Willits said, adding that in too many situations students must take classes they will not enjoy to substitute for the ones they really wanted. In addition, many schools require classes such as Western Civilization or a non-western culture course. "There are only a few of those classes around for so many students," Wiltis said. "They don't have many choices." More than 45 sections of Western Civilization 234 and 235, which have classes of about 25 students each, are available each semester, said Kay Chatman, senior instructor. There also are two lecture courses, Western Civilization 204 and 205, that hold 600 students. These courses have discussion groups of about 12 students each. Usually about 2,000 students are in the program every semester. However, at least 15,000 students must take Western Civilization to graduate. There are also two honors courses, Western Civilization 114 and 115, which are similar to the 204 and 205 courses. But these are limited to students in the honors program and only have about 200 students in both courses. Chatman said students were not able to get into the Western Civilization courses because they were not flexible. "Many students don't want to take the big lecture, 'Chatman said,' and that's foolish. It's not as bad as many big lecture courses at this University." Chatman said students would be better off scheduling their courses around Western Civilization instead of scheduling it around their other courses. "It would definitely improve their chances," she said. "They do have a lot of students to compete with." Some administrators say getting classes isn't the problem — it's dropping them. "We fill as many classes as we can and then by the end of the middle of the semester there are 15-percent vacancies because the students withdraw," Carothers said. "There were probably other people who wanted those classes, or needed those classes, but by then it's too late." Students who drop those classes also are making it hard on themselves when it comes time to finish school. "There are only so many times you can take 13 hours a semester and be OK." he said. Carothers doesn't think it's very often that closed classes keep students from graduating on time. "We work very hard to accommodate graduating seniors," he said. --do require activities that force the student to finish late. The School of Fine Arts is one example. Most music majors must enroll in ensembles every semester, but can only get credit for a specified number of hours, said Denis Brown, associate dean of the school. Whether students graduate in four years also depends on the school in which they are enrolled. The program at the School of Architecture and Urban Design is structured to last five years. Dennis Domer, associate dean of the school, said a student had to average 18 hours each semester to finish in five years. And he said that architecture and many other schools are adding requirements every year at the University's request. "It is a very strenuous program already," Domer said, "and they are asking us to do more. We are busting our britches teaching that much already. And the students are overloaded." Domer said a developing trend for the students in the school was to get a liberal arts degree in four years and then get their masters in architecture in three. "In 10 years, as many as 50 percent of our students may be forced to do that," Domer said. The School of Education became a five-year program in the 1981-82 academic year. Jerry Bailey, associate dean of the school, said the demand on the instructors in the school forced the change. Education students must average 17 hours a semester to graduate in five years. Many students in the school do not have time to take summer courses or an independent study course and do not want to take a heavy load. They finish in five and a half or six years. Bailey said. Then there are schools that are not structured as five-year programs but Graduation distribution Breakdown of number of students by school who have already graduated or who are graduating this semester. School 1989 Change 1990 Change 1991 Change 1992 Change 1993 Change Allied Health 97 +25 131 +34 148 +17 168 +18 196 +30 Architecture/ Urban Design 97 -8 87 -10 96 +9 95 -1 94 -1 Business 411 -1 437 +26 433 -4 438 +5 459 +21 CLAS 1,983 +10 2,095 +112 2,249 +154 2,343 +94 2,421 +78 Education 1,927 +94 1,940 +13 1,858 -82 1,908 +50 1,808 -100 Engineering 492 +33 485 -7 482 -3 545 +63 606 +61 Fine Arts 116 +11 120 +4 132 +12 129 -3 125 -4 Journalism 74 +12 73 -1 62 -11 51 -11 67 +16 Medicine 111 +1 116 +5 115 -1 113 -2 123 +10 Nursing 198 +14 178 -20 186 +8 234 +48 260 +26 Pharmacy 198 +25 194 -4 184 -10 198 +14 218 +20 Social Welfare 24 +3 25 +1 35 +10 39 +4 38 -1 Total 5,728 +220 5,881 +153 5,980 +99 6,259 +279 6,415 +156 TOTAL ENROLLMENT 26,804 -284 27,182 +378 27,335 +153 27,333 -2 27,589 +236 Percentages of fall, first-time freshmen who had graduated or were still enrolled in Fall 1991. Graduation rates compared Dave Campbell / KANSAN
KansasKansas St.Witchita St.Emporia St.Pittsburg St.
% Grad% Enrol% Grad% Enrol% Grad% Enrol% Grad% Enrol% Grad% Enrol
198724.737.118.5447.836.820.426.324.927.1
198649.78.242.512.721.920.536.27.734.67.6
198554.63.944.84.930.313.438.34.639.45.3
198357.31.5501.634.48.438.9.842.72.5
Source: KU/Office of Institutional Research and Planning Many carry scholarships that require the student to enroll in one major ensemble a semester, even if they can no longer receive credit for it. "Music students take a lot more hours than they need to," Brown said. Source: KU Office of Institutional Research and Planning Those who are majoring in music performance or an art can fall behind because they must pass certain classes. If they do not, they must repeat the class. "The days of the four-year student in our school are minimal," he said. KU may have to get used to a low four-year graduation rate. Its status as a public institution with no admission standards for in-state students makes it tough for the University to recruit the highest quality students. "If you are at a university that has to have 1,000 people in a classroom, you'd better make sure that a student has enough skills to learn in that environment," said Mary Crystal Cage, reporter for The Chronicle of Higher Education. Cage has studied graduation rates and has written numerous articles on the subject. "Those schools who tend to have higher admission standards also tend to have higher graduation rates," she said. KU isn't in that group. Perhaps what hurts kU the worst is the fact that too many students enter KU who would have a poor chance of finishing at any college. Dave Campbell / KANSAN KU has been trying for at least 10 years to pass a qualified admissions bill. The Kansas Senate recently passed a bill that would have required high school seniors to have a 23 on the ACT, a 2.0 grade point average or a ranking of the top one-third of their class to enter a state university. But that bill was voted down by the House. Kansas is the only state in the United States that does not have at least some kind of qualified admissions for Regents universities. The University of North Carolina and the University of Virginia, both public institutions, graduate more than 60 percent of their students within four years. Both of those schools have high admissions standards. David Shulenburger, acting vice chancellor for academic affairs, said a university's graduation rate always was associated with its selectivity. He said the qualified admissions proposal was the best way to ensure that students are qualified to go to a Regents university. "The Harvards and the Yales of the world have high rates because they get the best students. "That is exactly why this university supports qualified admissions," he said. Harvard and Yale both graduate 90 percent of their students within four years. The low percentage of students --don't get out on time, it's not KU's responsibility. Shulenburger admits there are a few times when students have to stay behind and the University is at fault. But in the end, if most students The low percentage of students graduating in four years is a concern of the University, and University administrators are pondering what they can do. "They may not have enough money to be full-time students, or they may change their minds a lot," he said, "but you can't really find the critical instances where a student was held back because of the University." But who says that a student who does not graduate in four years is a failure? A degree is not accompanied by a red stamp that says, "By the way, did you know that this person took an extra semester?" There are some advantages to ensuring an education is not rushed, VanZandt said. "Nowhere is it written in scripture that 'thou shalt graduate in eight semesters,'" he said. "Those who sacrifice lot of other valuable experiences just to graduate on time probably are not doing themselves a favor. College is enjoyable. It should be savored." "We've had people major in anthropology here who had never heard of it when they came here as freshman." Carothers said. Rushing to choose a major because of the tremendous time pressures put on them by peers and parents can cause troubles for students, Carothers said. At a big university a little self-discovery is in order. Maybe the real issue, despite what Mom or Dad may say, is not how long it takes. Maybe the issue is just finishing. VanZandt said he encourages students to finish in four years but more than that, he encourages them to finish. "It isn't how quickly you finish," he said. "Whether it takes you four years or 10, finishing is the important thing." NATURAL WAY - 820-822 Mass St. Jayhawk Bookstore "At the top of Naismith Hill!" Hrs: 8-5 M-F, 9-5 Sat, 12-4 Sun Clip and Save with Daily Kansan Coupons !!! 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